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Help us improve www.shmax.com => Bugs? On www.shmax.com? Ha ha, you kill me... => Topic started by: Jazz 342 on September 07, 2012, 09:20:13 PM

Title: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on September 07, 2012, 09:20:13 PM
I have a 25th anniversary Titanium Optimus Prime http://shmax.com/product_details/5369/optimus_prime
but looking at the eBay listings its calling up values of the heroes of cybertron PVC figure
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 07, 2012, 09:45:00 PM

I have a 25th anniversary Titanium Optimus Prime http://shmax.com/product_details/5369/optimus_prime
but looking at the eBay listings its calling up values of the heroes of cybertron PVC figure


Hmm, now that's a tricky one. I tried changing the search parameters such that "cybertron heroes" appears (with quotes), but then no results turn up. Does the term "cybertron heroes" actually appear on the packaging anywhere? eBay'ers don't seem to be using the terms in their auction titles.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on September 07, 2012, 10:05:56 PM
Not that I've noticed.
Also I've found another item with the same problem,  but this one may be more difficult to fix... the burning fallen that was a Target exclusive.   http://shmax.com/product_details/5981/the_fallen
Seems that due to the name of this one also being part of the name of the series leads to data being pulled randomly from eBay.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on September 08, 2012, 08:21:27 AM
Cybertron Heroes is the name of the 6" line.  Robot Masters is the name of the 3" line.  Not sure why eBayers wouldn't use them, but those ARE the name of the sub-lines. 

Actually, looking at that listing...Titaniums used to be a stand-alone TF line (in terms of our TF database, but when line expansion comes, it will gain upper-level status as there are Marvel, Star Wars, and Battlestar Galactica Titaniums), but when the TF Titaniums, as a line, got axed, they had some stuff that got released under Universe (perhaps as that was the current line at the time). 

This Prime is one of them, along with his casemates Thrust and Hot Zone.  So, I guess there are a variety of factors that could give wonky numbers.  The similarly-named "Heroes of Cybertron" mostly-PVC line doesn't help things either.  :(

Yeah, having the guy's name (The Fallen) as part of the toy line sure doesn't help things.  Could there be a way that we look for "The Fallen" to appear twice for any toys of "The Fallen"?  Even a "the fallen the fallen" search on our own database still turns up the entire ROTF line.

MIKE
engledogg
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on September 08, 2012, 09:52:57 AM
I believe its officially called burning fallen or something like that, I did an eBay search with that term and it worked. The shmax title doesn't have burning in it.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on September 08, 2012, 10:00:36 AM
I really hope I'm not annoying you guys, I'm only trying to be helpful and being new, I just notice things as I've reviewed my personal collection.  As such, you have FOC shockwave listed as 003 shockwave and getting no hits with the eBay search,  if shmax could add FOC to the title it would have eBay hits.
Again you guys rock!
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 08, 2012, 11:11:02 AM

I believe its officially called burning fallen or something like that, I did an eBay search with that term and it worked. The shmax title doesn't have burning in it.


Are we talking about this item (we don't have a photo of it on shmax, so I'm not sure)?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170901300975

If so, we definitely try not to include any terms in the product title that aren't explicitly called out on the packaging.

That said, I was able to greatly reduce the number of false positives for this one by:
1. Fixing a bug that was causing generation of the "blacklist" to fail
2. forcing "voyager" and "exclusive" into the search terms

Better?
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 08, 2012, 11:14:54 AM

I really hope I'm not annoying you guys, I'm only trying to be helpful and being new, I just notice things as I've reviewed my personal collection.  As such, you have FOC shockwave listed as 003 shockwave and getting no hits with the eBay search,  if shmax could add FOC to the title it would have eBay hits.
Again you guys rock!


Please provide a link to the item you're talking about. It really saves me a lot of time when you do that. Thanks much.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on September 08, 2012, 02:25:31 PM
http://shmax.com/product_details/10370/shockwave
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 08, 2012, 02:39:32 PM

http://shmax.com/product_details/10370/shockwave


Ah, I see what you mean. Engledogg, should we have a "Fall of Cybertron" node in the toyline tree?
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 10, 2012, 08:42:07 PM
bump for Ed
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on September 10, 2012, 08:59:36 PM
Nope...no need for any new subcategory.  The line is just plain ol' Generations...and the toy is called Shockwave (not Fall of Cybertron Shockwave).  If we would create a Fall of Cybertron node, there would be nothing to counterbalance it for the regular toys that will be released that aren't FOC-related.

As for the item in question, I'm not sure why we're not getting results. 

An eBay search for "Generations Shockwave" turns up 78 current results:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=generations+shockwave&_sacat=0

"FOC Shockwave" would only produce 15:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=foc+shockwave&_sacat=0&_odkw=generations+shockwave&_osacat=0

and most of the results for "Fall of Cybertron Shockwave":
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=fall+of+cybertron+shockwave&_sacat=0&_odkw=fall+of+cybertron&_osacat=0

are shared by the "Generations Shockwave" search. 

If we're searching for "003 Shockwave", I can see how that may limit results, but even then, a search for "003 Shockwave" on eBay yields three results:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/Action-Figures-/246/i.html?_nkw=003+shockwave

MIKE
engledogg

Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on September 10, 2012, 09:40:18 PM

Nope...no need for any new subcategory.  The line is just plain ol' Generations...and the toy is called Shockwave (not Fall of Cybertron Shockwave).  If we would create a Fall of Cybertron node, there would be nothing to counterbalance it for the regular toys that will be released that aren't FOC-related.

As for the item in question, I'm not sure why we're not getting results. 

An eBay search for "Generations Shockwave" turns up 78 current results:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=generations+shockwave&_sacat=0

"FOC Shockwave" would only produce 15:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=foc+shockwave&_sacat=0&_odkw=generations+shockwave&_osacat=0

and most of the results for "Fall of Cybertron Shockwave":
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=fall+of+cybertron+shockwave&_sacat=0&_odkw=fall+of+cybertron&_osacat=0

are shared by the "Generations Shockwave" search. 

If we're searching for "003 Shockwave", I can see how that may limit results, but even then, a search for "003 Shockwave" on eBay yields three results:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/Action-Figures-/246/i.html?_nkw=003+shockwave

MIKE
engledogg


Something does seem a little suspicious when you break it down like that. I found that the code that creates the search string was choking on the parentheses in the "Generations (2012)" toyline name. I'm now tossing the parentheses (and their contents) out, and things seem a little better. Still, I'm not seeing as many results as I would expect, so something may still be a touch janky. I'll work on it...

http://shmax.com/product_details/10370/shockwave
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Tripredacus on September 11, 2012, 07:53:16 AM
Do you really need to call it Generations (2012) ?? Why put the year in the name at all? It is already in the figure record on the search results page on the release date. If I look at the master US listing in the product tree, there is a Generations (2012) but no other Generations listing. I know there is another Generations, but it is a sub-category of the Transformers (2010) category.

Anyways, I'm not a fan of including years in the product line name like that, but that's just me. I'd say kill the 2010 off of the Transformers category (again, there is no other Transformers category anyways), then take the Generations (2012) and put that into the Generations sub-category and ax the year off it. There are a few other ways to deal with it, this product is basically

Transformers
- Generations
-- Fall of Cybertron

Any way you look at it.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on September 11, 2012, 08:18:54 AM
Originally, we did it to keep it separate it from the first iteration of Generations, sorta like what was done with Universe and Universe (2008) as the two were very different lines. 

Adding years to the names of category has nothing to do with the year of the toy release...it is/was simply a way to differentiate it from previous lines with the same name.  The addition of the year is a pretty rare occurence in the database.  That's why you don't see Dark of the Moon (2011) or Revenge of the Fallen (2009) or why Smokescreen (http://www.shmax.com/product_details/4685/smokescreen) is under Universe (2008), even though he was released in 2009.  Stuff in parentheses isn't generally a problem. 

As far as Transformers (2010), goes that's always been a bit of a nightmare, in terms of organization.  Transformers 2010 was pretty much the "fan-accepted" term for quite a while (in fact, you'll find it referred to as both Transformers and Transformers (2010) on the Wiki), but it could make some sense now just to call it "Transformers".  There are several things that complicate the situation, involving the subcategories.  Technically, and we've been over this before, only the Deluxe Class figures were technically "Generations" figures.  But, they share the same packaging with the 2010 Activators.  So, what do we dump those Activators into?  A new high-level category called "Activators", on par with "Generations"?  Or leave them where they're at?

What you're describing above, about Generations, is a possibility.  Instead of having Generations (2012) as its own line, we could incorporate all that stuff into the first Generations listing, just treating the 2012 offerings as a transition in packaging.  (Note: The Chinese Import TRU exclusives should be in the original Generations line, as should the MP figures.)  But, Generations seems to have progressed beyond just being a subcategory of only Deluxes as this appears to be one of Hasbro's top level lines, especially with the addition of the Voyager size class, with Prime being the main line.  That's sorta why we gave it top-level status as it was different enough from the technically Deluxe-only Generations line from 2010.

Fall of Cybertron is NOT a true subline, so we likely won't be creating a new node for it.  Just like the War for Cybertron (which was present on some of the packaging) toys didn't get a node of their own, I'm thinking that should these shouldn't either - unless it would turn out that ONLY FoC characters are available in this new packaging, then that might warrant a subcategory (and would actually help with the organization).

I'll work on this a bit to try to make everything a bit more...organized.

MIKE
engledogg
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on September 11, 2012, 08:44:40 AM
Also, technically, there was a "Transformers" line released in 2003:

http://www.shmax.com/product_details/3444/optimus_prime

Sure, it uses the RID packaging style but the only thing found on the packaging is "Transformers".  So should we have this aberration in nomenclature be a top-level category?  And if we do, would the 2010 version of "Transformers" be a continuation of it?  If not, then how do we differentiate between the two very different lines?  Should we call the Spy Changer line "Transformers" and the Transformers line from 2010...maybe Transformers (2010)?  :)

Of course, I'm being facetious...I'm just saying that naming (and organizing) these categories isn't as easy as it looks.  It has to make sense and be able to work with other stuff in the database.

MIKE
engledogg

Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Tripredacus on September 12, 2012, 12:01:29 PM
Oh I certainly know the problems with the naming of the lines. I tend to just keep things simple and use what is actually on the package. The only problem was the RID line (thanks for bringing it up, but your example is actually Armada packaging) actually using Robots in Disguise as the title of the series. Beforehand, it was simply just a slogan that appeared on the packaging.

I think maybe what makes it difficult here is that you can potentially see the different sections using the tree view, whereas in my lists, you can only see 1 year/country at a time which is the perspective that I am viewing this with.

Anyways, my comment isn't a complaint or anything. I say just go with what works.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on October 14, 2012, 04:02:00 PM
For some reason titanium optimus is linking to cybertron optimus again. http://shmax.com/product_details/5369/optimus_prime
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on October 15, 2012, 12:10:06 AM

For some reason titanium optimus is linking to cybertron optimus again. http://shmax.com/product_details/5369/optimus_prime


Working on it. More soon.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on October 15, 2012, 11:31:36 PM
Still working on it! Well, actually the code's done and it works, but I had to tear a lot of stuff apart to fix this, and I don't want to check it in until I can spend some time testing it. This was sort of an interesting one:

1. This toy lives in a category that is a child of a node called "Cybertron Heroes". We had this marked as a "subline". I won't go into the details of the algorithm that generates the search, but in a nutshell this was winding up in the search string being sent to eBay, and sellers apparently never use the term (presumably because it's either not on the packaging, or is somewhere inconspicuous).

2. To weasel around this, I switched "Cybertron Heroes" from "subline" to "minor", and promoted the child, "Universe" to subline.  There's a bit of logic in the search generation algorithm that decides if both the subline and toyline names are needed; if the subline name is not in use by any other toys with the same name but with a different toyline, it uses both the subline name and the toyline name. There were no other toys with a subline name of "universe", so the algo decided it didn't need the toyline name, which produced too broad of a search. An easy tweak was to simply check if the subline name shared the name of any toylines in use by the similar toys (named "optimus prime"), and if it did, include both the toyline and subline.

Does your brain hurt yet? Mine does.

So for this particular toy, the subline was "universe". The only similar toyline was called "universe (2008)", which didn't match, so the toyline was not added to the search string. So I tweaked things such that all parenthetical terms are removed when doing all this figurin'.

"But wait!" you yell. "What about the regular 'universe' toyline?" Yes, it should have turned up a match. It didn't, because when I was working locally I accidentally switched it to "minor".

To make a dumb story short, I fixed everything and it works swell locally, and will check in soon.

I'm glad we could have this talk.
Title: Re: ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on October 16, 2012, 08:31:15 PM
Okay, everything's checked-in. Check it out:

http://shmax.com/product_details/5369/optimus_prime

Still not seeing as many auctions as I would like to see, but the auctions we do match seem to be spot-on.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on October 16, 2012, 09:57:06 PM
Sounds complicated.  Why does the price history chart stop at October 2011?
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on October 16, 2012, 10:24:03 PM

Sounds complicated.  Why does the price history chart stop at October 2011?


That's a very good question, and is the next mystery I intend to solve. Thanks for hanging in there.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 12, 2012, 06:55:40 PM


Sounds complicated.  Why does the price history chart stop at October 2011?


That's a very good question, and is the next mystery I intend to solve. Thanks for hanging in there.


Mystery solved! I've checked in a fix, and everything should be groovy once more in a few hours.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on November 14, 2012, 09:13:22 PM
Is there a global fix for this? It seems like a common issue that the price history isnt self-updating.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 14, 2012, 09:34:01 PM

Is there a global fix for this? It seems like a common issue that the price history isnt self-updating.


Yes, it seems that my automated scripts aren't properly refreshing products. Working on it...
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 15, 2012, 01:05:17 AM


Is there a global fix for this? It seems like a common issue that the price history isnt self-updating.


Yes, it seems that my automated scripts aren't properly refreshing products. Working on it...


Fix checked-in. Everything should be shiny by morning... please verify. Thanks much.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 15, 2012, 07:58:44 AM



Is there a global fix for this? It seems like a common issue that the price history isnt self-updating.


Yes, it seems that my automated scripts aren't properly refreshing products. Working on it...


Fix checked-in. Everything should be shiny by morning... please verify. Thanks much.


Whoops--I just found a bug that was preventing all products from updating. I've fixed it, and restart all my scripts, so please check back in about 5 hours...
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on November 17, 2012, 08:35:02 PM
Your fix seems to have helped significantly, but there are still a few items in my collection that are still buggy. Ill post links when I get a chance. Awesome work, guys!
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on November 17, 2012, 11:18:57 PM
shmax, check this one out:

http://shmax.com/product_details/3425/robot_man_x_red_and_yellow

It seems to be ignoring the Argentina category, giving results for the U.S. versions.

MIKE
engledogg
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 18, 2012, 10:14:17 AM

shmax, check this one out:

http://shmax.com/product_details/3425/robot_man_x_red_and_yellow

It seems to be ignoring the Argentina category, giving results for the U.S. versions.

MIKE
engledogg


Looks like somebody had added "topspin" to the search keywords. I removed it.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: engledogg on November 18, 2012, 12:26:22 PM
Ah, that'd do it...we'll have to do that with the rest of those guys as well.

MIKE
engledogg
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on November 19, 2012, 09:29:47 PM
Here's my list of items which for some reason aren't showing updated values. In fact they show "current value unknown. ":
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2399/autobot_jazz
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2395/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/305/bumblebee_camaro_concept
http://shmax.com/product_details/6403/constructicon_devastator
http://shmax.com/product_details/278/rodimus
http://shmax.com/product_details/3574/the_ultimate_battle_optimus_prime_vs_megatron
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 21, 2012, 10:33:08 AM

Here's my list of items which for some reason aren't showing updated values. In fact they show "current value unknown. ":
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2399/autobot_jazz
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2395/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/305/bumblebee_camaro_concept
http://shmax.com/product_details/6403/constructicon_devastator
http://shmax.com/product_details/278/rodimus
http://shmax.com/product_details/3574/the_ultimate_battle_optimus_prime_vs_megatron


I have some work in progress that will help with this kind of issue, but I'm off for a few days for Turkey Time. Thanks for hanging in there.
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 21, 2012, 12:04:07 PM


Here's my list of items which for some reason aren't showing updated values. In fact they show "current value unknown. ":
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2399/autobot_jazz
http://shmax.com/product_details/3670/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/2395/bumblebee
http://shmax.com/product_details/305/bumblebee_camaro_concept
http://shmax.com/product_details/6403/constructicon_devastator
http://shmax.com/product_details/278/rodimus
http://shmax.com/product_details/3574/the_ultimate_battle_optimus_prime_vs_megatron


I have some work in progress that will help with this kind of issue, but I'm off for a few days for Turkey Time. Thanks for hanging in there.


I'm out the door, but I did find and fix a bug that should fix toys like Rodimus. I also added the word "prime" to his greenlist so it doesn't get picked off by the matching algorithm. And I'm off! Happy Thanksgiving, turkeys!
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Jazz 342 on November 26, 2012, 11:55:42 AM
Looks like you fixed it for me. All item values shifted up and down this weekend ... universe smokescreen sold for $45 while my higher ticket items dropped a bit...
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: shmax on November 26, 2012, 01:07:52 PM

Looks like you fixed it for me. All item values shifted up and down this weekend ... universe smokescreen sold for $45 while my higher ticket items dropped a bit...


I'm still tweaking things a bit, so anything can happen. Don't make any down payments on any yachts based on your appraisal values until I sound the all clear...
Title: Re: [RESOLVED]ebay listings dont match pictured item
Post by: Tripredacus on November 27, 2012, 07:45:06 AM

Looks like you fixed it for me. All item values shifted up and down this weekend ... universe smokescreen sold for $45 while my higher ticket items dropped a bit...


I noticed a bit of change myself. I used the example of Brave Max, which earlier this year was selling for $500-600. Then this change happened and his value dropped. So I went to ebay and checked myself, and yep the sold prices have indeed fallen. I expect that this is probably due to the announcement of the Fort Max reissue. Its interesting that now we can see some relatively quick change in the market by monitoring our collection values.